Free 3D
3D Print Models
3D Scans
Animation & MoCap
Textures
Materials
Skin Reference
2D Game Assets
Sound Effects
Brushes & Tools
Reference Photos
Stock Images
HDR Images
3ds Max
Maya
Blender
Unreal Engine
Unity
ZBrush
Cinema 4D
LightWave
Marmoset
SketchUp
FBX
DAE
DXF
GLBUber or PBRSkin
200Thread Activity
Luxe MuseSun, Feb 08
Luxe MuseSun, Feb 08
Luxe MuseSun, Feb 08
PastilSun, Feb 08
Luxe MuseSun, Feb 08
Pushee-RiSun, Feb 08
I'm very curious about what most people prefer now. Personally, I think both are good, but I'm more accustomed to the PBRSkin shader. How about you? And more importantly, why?
! REPORT
I prefer PBRSkin giving good results, little bit slow but can optimize, even works well with the animations. I created my custom Genesis 8 figure also using 
PBR details for eyes and skin microdetails perfect.
PBR details for eyes and skin microdetails perfect.REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05That's a good point. I personally keep all the micro-details in the bump and normal layers, rather than in the detail layers. It might be a little slower during pre-blending, but it shouldn't affect render pass performance.
I think the performance hit comes from the shader's own internal math and operations. Perhaps the detail layers trigger some very expensive calculations in the underlying native surface shader, whereas the uber shader might offload some of those to the vertex stage. (I might be mixing this up with old DirectX shader bottlenecks from my early days, but I believe the principles still apply.)
I think the performance hit comes from the shader's own internal math and operations. Perhaps the detail layers trigger some very expensive calculations in the underlying native surface shader, whereas the uber shader might offload some of those to the vertex stage. (I might be mixing this up with old DirectX shader bottlenecks from my early days, but I believe the principles still apply.)
I prefer Uber skin material.
While PBR skin looks amazing on dark skin types, bright skin always looks flat and dry like unglazed ceramics.
While PBR skin looks amazing on dark skin types, bright skin always looks flat and dry like unglazed ceramics.
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05Thank you, Masterstroke. I am currently working on Amelia's Uber material, but I remember when I worked on Hanna's, things just looked naturally oily, and I thought, what is this sorcery?
I have noticed that most skins tend to look more alabaster in Uber than in PBRSkin. I love alabaster skin, and for me, when I use PBR, I put more effort into tweaking translucency for that reason otherwise it simply doesn't come out the way I want it. Whereas for tanned or chocolate skin, I really do not need to do as much.
Regarding the flatness, I am with you on that. I struggle with it. However, to me, the results improve a lot when I adjust Specular and Roughness.
I have noticed that most skins tend to look more alabaster in Uber than in PBRSkin. I love alabaster skin, and for me, when I use PBR, I put more effort into tweaking translucency for that reason otherwise it simply doesn't come out the way I want it. Whereas for tanned or chocolate skin, I really do not need to do as much.
Regarding the flatness, I am with you on that. I struggle with it. However, to me, the results improve a lot when I adjust Specular and Roughness.
Here are my works with Amelia's skin for, first, PBRSkin, and then Uber at the bottom.
Uber (WIP)
Uber (WIP)
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05This is a G8 Base. The only difference in her Uber Skin (values) is that I've added 0.10 weight to Gloss, turned shared inputs on, and used the same specular and roughness maps for both the reflectivity and roughness channels, while keeping the same dual lobe specular setup from PBRSkin.
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05I like her Uber more, though it is not complete yet. It already looks a little better, in my opinion.
As for performance, a quick test shows that both are performing the same: 2% at 19 seconds with identical environment and render settings. I'm not claiming this is a real test, hi, hi, hi.
As for performance, a quick test shows that both are performing the same: 2% at 19 seconds with identical environment and render settings. I'm not claiming this is a real test, hi, hi, hi.
Are you considering a Genesis 8.1 version of Amelia? I think it would be great. I'm having issues with texture blending and correction morphs in Genesis 9.
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05Oh yes, I am very close to finishing her G8-8.1 version. 
I actually made a few more corrective morphs for her 8 than I did for 9. But I plan to continue adding corrective morphs for all versions, especially for ballet poses, which tend to stretch the limits. And who doesn't love ballet? Please don't answer that last one. I'd rather live in my fantasy world.
I actually made a few more corrective morphs for her 8 than I did for 9. But I plan to continue adding corrective morphs for all versions, especially for ballet poses, which tend to stretch the limits. And who doesn't love ballet? Please don't answer that last one. I'd rather live in my fantasy world.
I too prefer Uber on fair lighter skins but on some darker tanned skins PBR actually looks better. I use G9 but I still prefer G8.1 on females. At this point in my Daz journey if I don't like the way a skin looks I go into surfaces and the default templates and make adjustments there...if still no good I switch to another skin and another till I'm satisfied. From what I have discovered if you get the right skin and lighting just right renders look best. ..just my 2 cents
Luxe skins uber or pbr are excellent!
Luxe skins uber or pbr are excellent!
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05Thank you so much, Ted. You are always very kind to me. I think it makes sense, and you all have corroborated what I suspected.
Another thought I was having is that perhaps, when there is more than one figure in the scene, Uber does speed up the render. I do want to run some tests on this, probably this month.
Perhaps I should make an Uber option for all my G9 models as well.
Another thought I was having is that perhaps, when there is more than one figure in the scene, Uber does speed up the render. I do want to run some tests on this, probably this month.
Perhaps I should make an Uber option for all my G9 models as well.
PBR works better in unreal. Something to keep in mind.
REPLY
! REPORT
Masterstroke
Karma: 4,465
Thu, Feb 05As far as I understand IRAy Uber is already "PBR" material.
The PBR material we are talking about here, is a physical based material, that supposed to work better across plattform.
The PBR material we are talking about here, is a physical based material, that supposed to work better across plattform.
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05Good point from you both.
Perhaps the various settings and options in PBRSkin, compared to Uber, and the way both are generally set up or used for skins, are better reproducible in Unreal. Could that be the reason?
Perhaps the various settings and options in PBRSkin, compared to Uber, and the way both are generally set up or used for skins, are better reproducible in Unreal. Could that be the reason?
Basic genesis 8.1 with Uber. need to edit every single line of material_library
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05If the settings are the same, this clearly shows how Uber softens the tone by favoring lighter colors.
I'd like a PBR shader, with some Uber parameters.
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Thu, Feb 05That is very, very fair, @SupreMoomega! Just a little lemon juice, a mint leaf, and rum, you have a tasty Daiquiri.
So, again. Please help me out here.
What would you do, to get moisture on the PBR skin?
On those hyper real renders done with Blender and now even CC5, you can see that moisture in the pores of the skin.
How can you achive that with DAZ PBR shaders, especially on lighter skin?
What would you do, to get moisture on the PBR skin?
On those hyper real renders done with Blender and now even CC5, you can see that moisture in the pores of the skin.
How can you achive that with DAZ PBR shaders, especially on lighter skin?
REPLY
! REPORT
Pushee-Ri
Karma: 42,577
Sun, Feb 08I'm still quite ill (hence my long absence... and probably also some feverish ideas): This could work with a special map for Topcoat. For example, use a bump map with increased contrast and reduced bright areas as a basis. Then work a little with the Topcoat parameters and, if necessary, even use an additional Topcoat bump map.
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Sun, Feb 08I'm sorry to hear you're ill, Pushe-Ri. I hope you get better soon!!
I'm playing around with Amelia's Uber Map where I duplicated her specular and specular roughness maps on to the glossy layer. And also with lighting and tone mapping. Will share here once it finishes rendering.
I'm playing around with Amelia's Uber Map where I duplicated her specular and specular roughness maps on to the glossy layer. And also with lighting and tone mapping. Will share here once it finishes rendering.
Pastil
Karma: 725
Sun, Feb 08Dual Lobe Specular
Weight : 1
Reflectivity :1
Roughness Mult : 0.5
Ratio : 0.5
Try this one... I don't know what kind of moisture you want.
Weight : 1
Reflectivity :1
Roughness Mult : 0.5
Ratio : 0.5
Try this one... I don't know what kind of moisture you want.
I played around with her Uber Map a little more.
For the glossy weight and roughness, I use the specular map and the specular roughness map. She has a top coat weight map too, but I also use her specular roughness map for the top coat roughness. I changed the layering mode to Fresnel. Her bump maps are very soft; the pores are very light and small. Perhaps a stronger bump would help with the pores under the glossy layer effect.
For the glossy weight and roughness, I use the specular map and the specular roughness map. She has a top coat weight map too, but I also use her specular roughness map for the top coat roughness. I changed the layering mode to Fresnel. Her bump maps are very soft; the pores are very light and small. Perhaps a stronger bump would help with the pores under the glossy layer effect.
REPLY
! REPORT
Luxe Muse
Karma: 6,968
Sun, Feb 08I also reduce the light intensity compared to my usual very bright lighting setup. I set crushed blacks and burned highlights to 0.3 each, and I apply a 2.4 gamma correction, which is the default in my Luxe's render environment settings.