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GLBAnother reason to be glad I still (mostly) use good old Vicky Fourpointtwopluspl
172Thread Activity
diogenese19348Wed, May 13
TenserknotMon, May 11
PinspotterSat, May 09
BobbSat, May 09
BobbSat, May 09
LLSmoothJSat, May 09
First it was GPU's then CPU's followed closely by RAM and both hard drives and SSD's.
Now its motherboards....
https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/26/05/07/1651222/motherboard-sales-collapse-by-more-than-25
Good luck Daz3D on getting me to buy a subscription to your upcoming Studio that will require the mother
of all computers to run it.
Now its motherboards....
https://hardware.slashdot.org/story/26/05/07/1651222/motherboard-sales-collapse-by-more-than-25
Good luck Daz3D on getting me to buy a subscription to your upcoming Studio that will require the mother
of all computers to run it.
! REPORT
I get the feeling it's only going to get worse from here.
I think you can still get cases for cheap. LOL
Some bubbles need to burst and soon.
I think you can still get cases for cheap. LOL
Some bubbles need to burst and soon.
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! REPORT
Daz studio has essentially the same hardware requirements as a professional VFX Rig doing Hollywood level productions using side effects, Houdini & AutoDesk Maya.
Yet is it essentially useless for doing anything other than still renders.
Daz foolishly allowed a single hardware manufacturer, NIVIDIA to become the single point of failure in their entire business model by tying their software and all of their content to a single outdated brute force path tracer that requires a GPU. from a single manufacturer.
It is quite ironic how short-sighted a company could be during the peak of the good times.
They failed to heed the lesson that poser learned, at tremendous cost, when poser became dependent on daz3D to provide the high quality figures and content for the poser application right up into the point, where daz3D invented the incompatible Genesis format and left poser to become the vestigial relic that it is today.
And now NVIDIA has effectively abandoned the consumer GPU market in favor of much more lucrative enterprise solutions for AI compute.
While I think using a 20 plus year old figure such as Vicky 4 ,is a bit of an extreme solution, the fact is Daz users are left with no alternatives
But to stick with older content that is not as hardware as intensive.
Which again leads to poor sales of the new bloated 8K textured content that many vendors are putting out today.
Yet is it essentially useless for doing anything other than still renders.
Daz foolishly allowed a single hardware manufacturer, NIVIDIA to become the single point of failure in their entire business model by tying their software and all of their content to a single outdated brute force path tracer that requires a GPU. from a single manufacturer.
It is quite ironic how short-sighted a company could be during the peak of the good times.
They failed to heed the lesson that poser learned, at tremendous cost, when poser became dependent on daz3D to provide the high quality figures and content for the poser application right up into the point, where daz3D invented the incompatible Genesis format and left poser to become the vestigial relic that it is today.
And now NVIDIA has effectively abandoned the consumer GPU market in favor of much more lucrative enterprise solutions for AI compute.
While I think using a 20 plus year old figure such as Vicky 4 ,is a bit of an extreme solution, the fact is Daz users are left with no alternatives
But to stick with older content that is not as hardware as intensive.
Which again leads to poor sales of the new bloated 8K textured content that many vendors are putting out today.
REPLY
! REPORT
I don't see anything on "old V4", that makes her more old hardware friendly, than Genesis 3 or Genesis 8.
What would it be?
Mesh density, rigging or texture size?
Like G9, V4 is good for portraits only. V4 bensds like c**p. In order to fix that, you will need JCMs, which increases the amount of data.
Even the first Genesis looks like a better choice.
I am sorry, to spoil the mood, but the years of V4 reign has been a dark period of 3d figures, because among bad figures, one of the worst has been dominating the whole scene.
I hope, we won't run into the V4 effect again with G9.
If you're stuck with old hardware G1 to G8 can do the job easily as well.
What would it be?
Mesh density, rigging or texture size?
Like G9, V4 is good for portraits only. V4 bensds like c**p. In order to fix that, you will need JCMs, which increases the amount of data.
Even the first Genesis looks like a better choice.
I am sorry, to spoil the mood, but the years of V4 reign has been a dark period of 3d figures, because among bad figures, one of the worst has been dominating the whole scene.
I hope, we won't run into the V4 effect again with G9.
If you're stuck with old hardware G1 to G8 can do the job easily as well.
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"using a 20 plus year old figure such as Vicky 4 ,is a bit of an extreme solution"
@Anabran, Now see what you've done? Poor Vicky's eyes are all red from crying because she thinks that you don't find her pretty any more.
"There, there sweety, it's ok. He didn't mean it. He was talking about that bimbo La Femme over at R'Osity. Get your coat and we'll go shopping for something pretty and I'll take you out tonight. We'll go to our Italian restaurant ("Bottle of red,,,bottle of white!") than go dancing. You'll like that won't you babe."
I read somewhere that Poser and Daz had a tiff over the new Genesis figures and Poser refused to support them. This forced Daz do develop Studio, which was the death blow to Poser.
@Anabran, Now see what you've done? Poor Vicky's eyes are all red from crying because she thinks that you don't find her pretty any more.
"There, there sweety, it's ok. He didn't mean it. He was talking about that bimbo La Femme over at R'Osity. Get your coat and we'll go shopping for something pretty and I'll take you out tonight. We'll go to our Italian restaurant ("Bottle of red,,,bottle of white!") than go dancing. You'll like that won't you babe."
I read somewhere that Poser and Daz had a tiff over the new Genesis figures and Poser refused to support them. This forced Daz do develop Studio, which was the death blow to Poser.
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! REPORT
Masterstroke
Karma: 5,123
Fri, May 08The "death blow" to Poser has been the owner's lack of interest in improving their figures and software.
diogenese19348
Karma: 420
Wed, May 13That was absolutely true when Smith Micro had it. The current owners are trying to reverse that, it's a long hard slog though, SM had Poser far too long. To be fair though, Smith Micro didn't just destroy Poser, they destroyed about every piece of software they bought, for about the same issues.
@Masterstroke, *sigh* Here's that old argument all over again.
I don't tie my characters into knots so the supposed bending problems don't affect me. The 4.2++ update (the latest iteration of V4) fixes all these problems anyway. I always dress my characters and don't do closeups. I can build a scene on my modest PC with 10 V&M4 characters (fully clothed) and still move around fairly easily. I can't do this with G8. more that 3 characters drags Studio to a crawl. The vast wardrobe available to V &M4 is another HUGE draw for me. All the Genesis bimbos together can't match the quantity and variety in Vicky's closet. Back in their heyday there where plenty of independent studios making content and these artists weren't locked into an endless stream of skimpware.
I don't tie my characters into knots so the supposed bending problems don't affect me. The 4.2++ update (the latest iteration of V4) fixes all these problems anyway. I always dress my characters and don't do closeups. I can build a scene on my modest PC with 10 V&M4 characters (fully clothed) and still move around fairly easily. I can't do this with G8. more that 3 characters drags Studio to a crawl. The vast wardrobe available to V &M4 is another HUGE draw for me. All the Genesis bimbos together can't match the quantity and variety in Vicky's closet. Back in their heyday there where plenty of independent studios making content and these artists weren't locked into an endless stream of skimpware.
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! REPORT
Masterstroke
Karma: 5,123
Fri, May 08Yep, well I guess that's just me. Even a figure wearing a space suit, its bad joints would bother me to no end.
Quote:I read somewhere that Poser and Daz had a tiff over the new Genesis figures and Poser refused to support them. This forced Daz do develop Studio, which was the death blow to Poser.
That is not true^^
I was active in the poser community since the late 1990s on the old poser forums.
I was poser vendor, for years, selling custom BVH files, for Mike. Vicki 2.
Daz was/is a 3D figure content company.
They had no actual platform in which to host their figures and content and were dependent upon poser.
This is a terrible business strategy, as you might imagine.
As poser began going through a period of extreme uncertainty and was quickly changing hands, Daz realized they're going to need their own software platform to support their content as having an external software as the single point of failure in your entire business model is a fool's Gambit.
The first early builds of Daz studio were publicly revealed, back during the era of the millennium 3 figures, BEFORE ANYONE PUBLICLY KNEW OF GENESIS.
As to the matter of poser "refusing to support " Genesis, actually, that is a wise decision because again you tie your entire business model to a figure who's development You do not own or control.
Where the slightest decimal point upgrade could continuously break compatibility.
Which is the reason why Reallusion developed their own suite of native higher quality figures for Iclone via character creator 1,2,3,4,5, even though they still support the import of Daz figures as well.
The problem for poser is that they lacked the will (or perhaps the funding or both ) to do what Reallusion did and instead continually put out really trash Poser native figures instead of spending the money on hiring some professional figure artist from
Artstation (or somewhere) to make them high quality figures.
Eventually resorted to depending on various third party, crowd sourced figures
, (whose names are too numerous to mention but you can do your research if you care to)
which is what Lafemme actually is.
The content vendors are the ones that technically "killed " poser.
They moved over to Daz to develop content for the Genesis figures, which are built to a uniform standard, that Daz can enforce to ensure that anyone who wants to become a Daz. PA. Has a knowledge base to work from based on fairly uniform standards as opposed to chasing around the latest exotic third party, home spun figure being offered up by some random person in the poser community and sorting it out yourself.
Quote:"The vast wardrobe available to V &M4 is another HUGE draw for me. All the Genesis bimbos together can't match the quantity and variety in Vicky's closet."
And finally, can we please put to rest this often Repeated mythology that Mike &Vicki 4 still has the "largest library of clothing content"?
While, that may possibly be true in terms of accumulated volume over the ages ( and frankly may no longer be the case in 2026)
The people never seem to mention that if you want to go back and use an older figure Daz Genesis 1 and 2, Can wear every bit of Mike & Vicky's clothing natively via the auto fit system in DS.and even switch to the M4/V4 UV's to "wear" their skin maps as well
and have far superior joint deformations in Daz studio
Although using V4s clothing and skin becomes a bit more tricky once you get to Genesis 3 and higher, but there are work arounds for that as well
But most people do not bother because Mike & Vicky's clothing comes with really old texture maps that are not really optimized for good results in the Iray Render engine.
That is not true^^
I was active in the poser community since the late 1990s on the old poser forums.
I was poser vendor, for years, selling custom BVH files, for Mike. Vicki 2.
Daz was/is a 3D figure content company.
They had no actual platform in which to host their figures and content and were dependent upon poser.
This is a terrible business strategy, as you might imagine.
As poser began going through a period of extreme uncertainty and was quickly changing hands, Daz realized they're going to need their own software platform to support their content as having an external software as the single point of failure in your entire business model is a fool's Gambit.
The first early builds of Daz studio were publicly revealed, back during the era of the millennium 3 figures, BEFORE ANYONE PUBLICLY KNEW OF GENESIS.
As to the matter of poser "refusing to support " Genesis, actually, that is a wise decision because again you tie your entire business model to a figure who's development You do not own or control.
Where the slightest decimal point upgrade could continuously break compatibility.
Which is the reason why Reallusion developed their own suite of native higher quality figures for Iclone via character creator 1,2,3,4,5, even though they still support the import of Daz figures as well.
The problem for poser is that they lacked the will (or perhaps the funding or both ) to do what Reallusion did and instead continually put out really trash Poser native figures instead of spending the money on hiring some professional figure artist from
Artstation (or somewhere) to make them high quality figures.
Eventually resorted to depending on various third party, crowd sourced figures
, (whose names are too numerous to mention but you can do your research if you care to)
which is what Lafemme actually is.
The content vendors are the ones that technically "killed " poser.
They moved over to Daz to develop content for the Genesis figures, which are built to a uniform standard, that Daz can enforce to ensure that anyone who wants to become a Daz. PA. Has a knowledge base to work from based on fairly uniform standards as opposed to chasing around the latest exotic third party, home spun figure being offered up by some random person in the poser community and sorting it out yourself.
Quote:"The vast wardrobe available to V &M4 is another HUGE draw for me. All the Genesis bimbos together can't match the quantity and variety in Vicky's closet."
And finally, can we please put to rest this often Repeated mythology that Mike &Vicki 4 still has the "largest library of clothing content"?
While, that may possibly be true in terms of accumulated volume over the ages ( and frankly may no longer be the case in 2026)
The people never seem to mention that if you want to go back and use an older figure Daz Genesis 1 and 2, Can wear every bit of Mike & Vicky's clothing natively via the auto fit system in DS.and even switch to the M4/V4 UV's to "wear" their skin maps as well
and have far superior joint deformations in Daz studio
Although using V4s clothing and skin becomes a bit more tricky once you get to Genesis 3 and higher, but there are work arounds for that as well
But most people do not bother because Mike & Vicky's clothing comes with really old texture maps that are not really optimized for good results in the Iray Render engine.
REPLY
! REPORT
Bobb
Karma: 1,412
Sat, May 09@Anabran, Thanks for the history lesson. I started with Poser when it was available on a CD in the back page of Boot magazine, but I never paid attention to all the politics and behind-the-scenes goings on.
Tenserknot
Karma: 9,368
Mon, May 11Genesis 8 works perfectly fine on 10 year old hardware and DazStudio 4.10. there's no need to go back to generation 4, unless you want to add a little variety, though as Anabran says, autofitted to genesis 1 is the best workaround with the iray converter and better bending and morphing.
As for subscriptions, I broke the addiction 3-4 years back, daz can go bye bye without any negative affect at this point.
As for subscriptions, I broke the addiction 3-4 years back, daz can go bye bye without any negative affect at this point.
Don't worry. I'm still Team Vicky 4.2 (More accurately Aiko 4.2, but details, details).
Would be nice for more content for the girl, but it is what it is (Worried about FoRender as there doesn't seem to have been any updates for two weeks now).
Would be nice for more content for the girl, but it is what it is (Worried about FoRender as there doesn't seem to have been any updates for two weeks now).
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Bobb
Karma: 1,412
Sat, May 09"FoRender"..."that's a name I've not heard in a long long time" (Quick...where does this quote come from?)
I'm browsing it now but it sure is slow. Some great characters though, I may have to buy one or two.
Thanks for the reminder.
Bobb.
I'm browsing it now but it sure is slow. Some great characters though, I may have to buy one or two.
Thanks for the reminder.
Bobb.
I said this ten years ago and I will say it again:
If current Genesis can present a character that looks like the characters I have right now, I might just switch to Genesis.
The fact that I haven't moved from V4 proves the point I am making. Realism is BORING, anime isn't popular because of its realism. Realism has a bigger cost than stylization, and it isn't as creative.
If current Genesis can present a character that looks like the characters I have right now, I might just switch to Genesis.
The fact that I haven't moved from V4 proves the point I am making. Realism is BORING, anime isn't popular because of its realism. Realism has a bigger cost than stylization, and it isn't as creative.
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