clones problem (CLOSED)

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EverwildWed, Jun 24

@Bu_esBut, I think this is what makes your characters present with different traits that don't make them seem or feel like cookie cutter images of eac

bu_esWed, Jun 24

I work with textures that are sold so that 99% of them are usable; I mix them with others I have. I never use them as is. In Renderosity, I created a

Pushee-RiWed, Jun 24

That's a smart point! Personally, I'd say: both. The problem, however, is creating a good 3D skin onto which the character's features can then be appl

Wolf007Wed, Jun 24

I imagine you are not the only one. And is probably not a bad way to have a starting point that can help artist avoid or diminish too much resemblance

MKDAWUSSWed, Jun 24

It also leads back to the question of whether or not the texture or the morph defines a character. There are certainly far more unique morphs than tex

Wolf007Wed, Jun 24

I understand that artist do have a style that sometimes is too strong and makes the catalog mostly similar. In those cases, where i like the style, i

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bu_esWed, Jun 24

Karma: 11,818

The other day, while chatting with Everwild on DM, he mentioned something he'd noticed: many of Daz's characters are becoming mere clones, and that detracts from the realism. What do you think?

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guy91600Wed, Jun 24

Karma: 19,502

It's true that when you look at a seller's shop too often, there's a certain family resemblance-especially in the faces; the variations are so subtle that you could easily mistake some models for twins smile

That also explains why there are often discounts in these stores.

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bu_es

Karma: 11,818

Wed, Jun 24

It's true that each seller has their own distinctive style, and I'm sure you'll be able to recognize one of my characters, even if only by the name. I have a habit of using Basque names, usually for characters who aren't from outside Europe.

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Pushee-RiWed, Jun 24

Karma: 52,487

The fact that a developer's characters tend to resemble one another is (in my opinion) due to personal preferences that are sometimes hard to shake (for me, it's round noses and a slight overbite). But now even characters from different developers look identical... and even the promotional images make it almost impossible to tell them apart. Personally, I find that a bit boring.

That's why I'm always happy to see characters by you (bu_es), Sza Trippie, Luxe Muse, or Ashen Portfolio (just to name a few-there are more), all of whom have that very special something.

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bu_esWed, Jun 24

Karma: 11,818

I'm going to make a confession, then I'll deny having said it, hehehe. Seriously though, many of my characters are based on real, non-famous people... although not 100%. That's why Face Fusion, etc., comes into play, to mix them with the characters and shapes I have... which, by the way, include morphs that never made it out of WIP. I have a ton of them. But let's keep it between us. (^_~)

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Wolf007

Karma: 297

Wed, Jun 24

I imagine you are not the only one. And is probably not a bad way to have a starting point that can help artist avoid or diminish too much resemblance.

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Everwild

Karma: 10,474

Wed, Jun 24

@Bu_es

But, I think this is what makes your characters present with different traits that don't make them seem or feel like cookie cutter images of each other. There are maybe two traits (a slight overbite and a receding chin) that show up in more than one of your characters. See Pushee-Ri's explanation above. But, it's not all of them.

I agree with some of what Guy91600 says, because some of that sameness is how the product/promo images are processed. But it's also found in facial features, body types, skin tone. Eyes. (Note that I realize offering different colored eyes for every model means more work, and lots of creators already offer a selection). However, I recently loaded in two characters from the same creator and other than slight deviations in height and hip/waist sizes, they were nearly identical. Very different skin tones, though. Still, it feeds that "cookie cutter" sameness I talked about.

But then, I also see a lot of similar facial markers in Frankie 9 that I see in Thomas 9 from Daz (to the point that I think Frankie's a derivative of).

Lastly and for the record, there is ZERO shame in using references. I had a sixth grade instructor once tell me that "real" artists never use references or rulers (or other tools), and years later I found out that was one of the biggest crocks of BS any instructor ever handed to me.

I don't purchase a lot of celebrity look alikes because I worry about IP issues (my characters need to be my own, which is also why I avoid using it straight "out of the box" for my universe). However, that said... I wouldn't mind if an Amy Lee or young Catherine Zeta-Jones turned up. Just sayin'. smile

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bu_esWed, Jun 24

Karma: 11,818

I also see many trying to create clones of celebrities who have their audience, but it has its risks. If that celebrity or the production company gets tough, it's a danger not only for the seller but also for the website..But this is a separate issue that is not relevant to what we are discussing.

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Wolf007Wed, Jun 24

Karma: 297

I understand that artist do have a style that sometimes is too strong and makes the catalog mostly similar. In those cases, where i like the style, i try to look for aspects that can bring something to the gene pool, like age details, or a more unique skin.

But there are other artists that looks like just randomize 10% of body morphs, 3% or less face features and maybe a skin tone if they are feeling bold and present their 'new' release. Of course those are totally made up numbers, but i think you get the idea. You look at the PA catalog and it looks like a photo portfolio of the same model. Sometimes don't even try enough different make up and hair colors to even save appearences. And there are several of those sellers in Daz Store. For some looks like only recently (or recent years) is were they started to not put as 'much effort', others (and i'm thiking on ONE ir particular but won't name) have been using the same model face for all his/her characters since at least G3 up to this day. Now, i suppose that it works for them, they must be selling enough to keep doing it.

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MKDAWUSSWed, Jun 24

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It also leads back to the question of whether or not the texture or the morph defines a character. There are certainly far more unique morphs than textures floating about in DAZ MPs.

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Pushee-Ri

Karma: 52,487

Wed, Jun 24

That's a smart point! Personally, I'd say: both. The problem, however, is creating a good 3D skin onto which the character's features can then be applied. Even with just a little eyeliner, eyeshadow, and blush, you can give a character a better, more intense, and sometimes even different look.

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bu_es

Karma: 11,818

Wed, Jun 24

I work with textures that are sold so that 99% of them are usable; I mix them with others I have. I never use them as is. In Renderosity, I created a texture myself, but I ran into problems with the most demanding beta tester. He absurdly rejected my skin three times for two pixels behind the ears on a G8. Then I had to change the skin because I was inexperienced at the time. That's how they forced me, and it's one of my least favorite characters. I mention the three pixels because I saw characters with bigger flaws and they were released.